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Andrew: Hi everyone. My name is Andrew Warner. I’m the founder of Mixergy.com Home of the ambitious upstart and the place where I interview entrepreneurs about how they built their businesses. So how do you use a book launch to generate big revenue and build a big following? Joining me is Loral Langemeier. She is the founder of Live Out Loud, a coaching, mentoring and consulting company. When she interviewed me recently about the upcoming launch of her new book, “Yes, Energy”, I saw that even the book launch was just a big business for Laurel. I said, I’ve got to get her in here, interview her about how she did that and also find out about her business in general. So Loral, thanks for coming and doing this interview.
Loral: Oh, thanks Andrew. I appreciate it. Looking forward to sharing lots of insights.
Andrew: Before I get to the book and the launch and where people can see the interview that you did with me, I notice when I look through your site that you say over and over that you’re a millionaire. Don’t you feel uncomfortable talking about that publicly?
Loral: It’s actually multi.
Andrew: Multi-millionaire.
Loral: Yeah.
Andrew: Most people who I interview are afraid to talk about their financials. Why do you talk about yours so publicly?
Loral: That’s interesting. I think that a lot of people are scared to talk about it. Here’s what I see, there’s either 1, they actually haven’t achieved it so they don’t want to talk about it, or what I see on the other side, because I’m known for making millions, my first book was the millionaire maker, is what I find is when people actually started accumulating some net worth, they actually become very silenced. It’s either one of the two. Because I teach a lot about finance, money, entrepreneurialism, and Live out Loud’s slogan, is to be in a conversation about money, I think I need to lead as an example. So, I took that on really early.
In the beginning, my millionaire status happened out of an event. I knew I was going to be a single mom, went, oh, I’m not going to go back and live on a farm in Nebraska where I grew up, and I was living in Sausalito, California, so no small price tag to live there. And so I just got to it. A lot of people have everything it takes to really create cash and create a big life and I just don’t think they put it all to work and know the sequence to do it. And so I did it for myself, and I was 34 when I became a millionaire, and it just became one of those landmark times, and ever since then I think it’s just been published about because I’m known as the millionaire maker, it’s always talked about and I’ll tell you saving millionaire status has really become the global financial crisis’s mission is helping people stay millionaires has been a big amount of work we’ve had to do in the last few years.
Andrew: All right. I want to find out how you did it yourself and I want to hear about how you’ve done it for other people. But the website that I talked about earlier where people can find out about your book and see the interview that you did with me and see this whole big thing that I noticed happening around you is what? What’s the URL?
Loral: It’s yesenergybook.com. Yesenergybook.com. And they can pre-order my book. My book’s not coming out until February. And they’ll see our interview, along with 43 other world [thought] leaders and amazing yes energy people that are very, very successful. What I appreciate about what you said, which is true, is that this isn’t just a book launch, and it’s not just another book. It’s truly, there’s a big business around it.
Andrew: So the book isn’t coming out until February, but you’re pre-selling it now. Why? Why so early? People are going to be watching this at different months, different years, but this is August of the year before you sell your book. Why now? Why do you start now?
Loral: Well, yeah, so we start it in August, and it will come out February 21. I’ve launched four big, best-selling books before, and usually, you know, most book launches go six to eight weeks, and it’s just in service of being a best seller, and I already know that’s going to occur. I just intended that to happen, with a lot of strategy. And the reason I’m really doing it is, I really teach, again, millionaires. I teach people how to make money. And coming out of the recession, depressionary years we’ve just lived through, so many people have no energy–literally no energy. Every reason why they’re never going to rebuild, they lost their millionaire status, their 401Ks are down, they’re still standing in unemployment lines. They don’t understand entrepreneurialism is where the game’s played. So there’s just so much negativity, that we looked at it and said, you know what, let’s combine the branding of all of the money and entrepreneurial training to Yes Energy, which still has a lot of do with it, and let’s talk a lot about why people need Yes Energy to regain their dreams, their success, get back in the game.
Everybody knows that’s really studied money in history is that the recovering year, which would be identified as one of the recovering years coming out, is the greatest transfer of wealth. You can buy the most assets on the planet, especially in America, for absolutely dirt-cheap prices, and interest rates are low. And if we can help you make money and you can buy that you can actually recover yours status, your millionaire status to multi-million faster. So we found, Andrew, that if we don’t help create a better mindset, ‘cuz really, the Yes Energy book is about say yes, and figure out how to get this done, that we’re going to turn the year and then 2012 will be another excuse, called the Presidential Election, and it just gives people another reason to just stay negative about things. So I thought, let’s campaign it. Let’s create and really just show the greatest Yes Energy people. There are billionaires in this summit; there are people from all over the world in this summit that will be interviewing.
Andrew: The summit to promote the book. So here’s the thing; I’ve got so many notes here. I want to find out about the businesses that you and your students have balled together. I want to find out about how you started out and what you did when you were pregnant to get your business going, and as you said, you made yourself into a millionaire at that point. But I want my audience to understand what I saw. So here’s the thing, here’s one thing that I saw. First of all, it’s a summit to promote the book. Second, you’re selling today, months ahead of time. You’re getting people to buy your book. Is that because Amazon treats all pre-orders as orders on the day of the book launch? Is that why you’re doing it so far in advance?
Loral: That’s part of it, but I’m not intending just in Amazon. I’m also going for all of them; I want a New York Time, I want a USA Today, I hope they’re all watching. We’re also in Australia.
Andrew: And if people buy the book early, then all those different ratings are impacted?
Loral: Absolutely. The more volume you have moving through the system early on, the more everybody looks at it at the bookstores. They know that there’s volume in the market. They know that there’s thousands . . . we already passed our 1,200 or 1,300th book already. So when bookstores see that, and there’s just a surge around that energy, it helps; and then with the summits. So clearly, there’s the book launch, which you know, definitely creates a buzz in the marketplace, creates blogging, creates media. I’ve already been back out on media on a lot more TV, a lot more radio. I’m being honored as the empowered entrepreneurial woman of the year in the next week. We’re going again . . .
Andrew: I’m sorry to interrupt, but there’s so much that I want to get to. You also, when you and I started out this interview, just before we launched, you said, ‘You can use an affiliate link so that you can make money as you’re selling the book.’ To me, this is a different mindset, but I dig it. I want to learn how you’ve done that. So by giving interviewers like me an affiliate link you give us an incentive to help promote the book, of course. Right? But you also do something reversed, where if you interview me, you say, Andrew I can help promote your stuff and get an affiliate commission off it. Talk about that. First of all, how do I get this all in, Loral? How do I get this all in? First of all, what’s the summit? I’ll go back a little bit and then we’ll fill in the gaps. It’s a summit to promote the book. Describe what a summit is.
Loral: Yeah, let me go back. So, when you do the book, anybody who wants to make money on the book can help sell the book. So when you go to yesenergybook.com, and you see the prizes we’re giving to people who really help sell the book, it’s easy. I’m taking people on private plane mentoring rides, the biggest one is I’m going to fly to your business and overhaul your entire business for free, on me.
Andrew: What do you have to do in order to get that?
Loral: 1,500 books.
Andrew: If you sell 1,500 books, or buy 1,500 books, you get that personal treatment?
Loral: Yep. Because that’s worth, you know, it’s not buyable. So, a lot of the things I’m giving you can’t just call us up and say I want that. So, I’m doing it in service of getting the book out to the world; I want Yes Energy in the world. And yeah, I want a best seller, but I also want to shift the conversation in that we can actually be proactive and aggressive again. And then, when affiliates make money; and I’m doing that also very different, Andrew. I’m paying all the way through a mentoring program. So every dollar that we make we share with whoever brought us the book buyer.
Andrew: So, if I give you a book buyer, I make money on selling the book. I get a commission and I also get a percentage of all the revenue that you earned from your relationship with that customer who I just sent you.
Loral: Absolutely. So, you can make a lot of money, I mean crazy amounts of money.
Andrew: A lot of money. What’s a lot of money? How much would I make? I’m giving this up because I don’t do affiliate programs when I do interviews, so how much am I giving up?
Loral: 50%.
Andrew: 50% of the revenue that you make, and how much money could you potentially make from someone who starts off by buying a book?
Loral: A book is only $24.95, so it’s $12.50. But then if they go on and buy something else they get another 50%. And then it goes further into the high price tags. You go to 25%, and then 10%. So it’s 50%, 25%, 10%. It’s a very lucrative model.
Andrew: What’s a higher price tag item that a customer might end up buying?
Loral: [inaudible] $1,500. Yeah. Some people make well into five, if not six figures by doing this. So, it’s not about just Loral getting a best seller; it’s about us getting the word out to a lot of people.
Andrew: What would someone have to buy for you to get $1,500 and me to get a commission on them?
Loral: How many people have to do what?
Andrew: What would someone have to buy for you to earn the $1,500 in revenue and for me to get a cut of that?
Loral: They would have to buy that many books.
Andrew: Oh, it’s the number of books. I see. OK. I mean, there’s a next level up. After someone buys a book, they also have an opportunity to buy something else, and something else. What’s the biggest ticket item?
Loral: $15,000 and you get $1,300. Let’s just say that you sold 50 people my book, and ten of them bought a $13,000 product. You would probably make over $7,500 bucks.
Andrew: And you said $15,000? What’s a $15,000 product?
Loral: That’s for 50 books. You help 50 people buy, you would probably get a check at least $7,500.
Andrew: I see; because of that.
Loral: And a lot of active people that really love what we’re doing, it could be as high as ten.
Andrew: OK. And then, afterwards it goes up to mentoring, where you sell higher ticket items.
Loral: Yep.
Andrew: OK. All right. You also get together a summit, where you bring together other entrepreneurs like me, you do interviews with them. Tell me about the traffic? How do you get people to come watch when you do something this big?
Loral: Well, again, I have a lot of people who would love that affiliate model. It’s a very generous, very lucrative, and the prizes are fun. The prizes you can’t buy. I mean, literally, I’m going to pick up people in Vegas; I’m going to take ’em away for 12 hours in a private plane and mentor them. They don’t know where we’re going to go. We’re going to stop for lunch, maybe have cocktails. We’ll just kind of make it up as a group as we go. So, that’ll be fun. Those are things that you can’t buy. Again, just depending on how people buy and win, it gets people excited. I want to create a buzz. I want the conversation. I seriously want to shift the success. So once people become affiliates and start buying the books, and then they clearly will be introduced to other education. The summit is critical, because I’m asking people in a combination; I’m picking 44 people that have never been together before. In fact, most of the 44 I would say maybe their circle of influence around that 44 maybe they know four or five other people. They don’t know a lot of the other people. I have them from several continents. I have owners of other companies.
Andrew: These are the speakers? Who are the 44 people?
Loral: They’re not just speakers. They’re speakers, they’re big internet marketers to billionaires that are tough to get interviews that wonder, why am I doing this? I have some Hollywood producers. I have New York comedians.
Andrew: I see. And they come on and they do kind of an interview like I did with you, where you talk to them and find out about them on behalf of your audience.
Loral: Correct.
Andrew: I see.
Loral: And so what will happen, Andrew, is when people that are on someone else’s database hear that you and I are doing this interview, they’re going to want to promote and they do promote. A lot of people are doing Facebook. They’re doing Twitter. They’re doing a lot of social media newsletters around it because they want to come hear the interviews of this eclectic, small group of people. So, it’s me interviewing 44 people.
When they pre-order the book, they get to see all these interviews for free. It’s an enormous opportunity to see just people who normally. . . I would say about half of them say, “I normally don’t do this.”
Andrew: Do the viewers have to buy a book in order to see the interviews?
Loral: If they want them for free, yeah.
Andrew: If they want them for free. I see how it works. If I had a huge audience, a huge email database, I would email them and say, “I’m going to be interviewing this rock star, and if you want to come watch me and 43 other people who are tremendously successful, interviewed by Loral, a success on her own, go over here and that’s where you see it.”
Their audience goes over, signs up, buys the book, the person who sent them over gets a commission. Lots of people are doing this, so you end up with a rush of people who are buying and also who are participating and who are learning. I got it. I see how it works. You, in turn, plug . . .
Loral: I’m going to go on the end of it, just like we did with you. Every interview ends with a gift. And so, as we did, if you want to hear more about Mixergy and go back and really be a follower and get on his list, so there’s also just a combination of people seeing different people. And if they’ve never known about you and they’ve come from someone else, then it’s a cross mix of the 44 that really creates a win for everybody.
Andrew: Gotcha. So, the person who’s being interviewed also ends up with a huge audience of potential buyers for his or her products and you as an affiliate of his products get a commission to that, too.
Loral: If it makes sense to do it and they have a model for that. Some people don’t have a model for that but yeah we would coach them.
Andrew: I happen to not have a model for it. I’ve watched that and I said, “That’s a tremendous way to promote a book, to get customers for a book, to get au audience to come in, to be involved in the conversation, and it’s a win-win even for the interviewers, for the interviewees. How do you get a billionaire to say yes to doing an interview and being a pat of this summit?
Loral: Here’s my advice. I mean, seriously, I could tell I wasn’t getting there. And so, I said, “If yes was the answer, what would have to happen?”
Andrew: Ah, OK. You’re asking the guest, “How can I get you to say yes?”
Loral: And they would have all sorts of restrictions and all sorts of things they don’t want to talk about. I said, “OK. If I do all that, do I get a yes?” And so, I would just keep at it and many, many hours of conversations with some of them. One of them is hysterical. He’s very, very low key. In fact, I am going to go interview him tomorrow live in Utah. We’ll see how much I’ll get disclosed, but he is . . . Last when we talked, he was making over $200 million a month and he’s just like this . . . I call him this underground super star. Nobody would even know his name, but boy I cannot wait to be in his presence, interview him in his home and his business. We’re going to take a tour. [??]
Andrew: Who is this person?
Loral: He’s going to private label the “Got Energy” drinks. We’re also doing a whole bunch, so again this is more of a business. We’re doing “Got Energy” drinks, which is going to be a healthy drink, no additives or preservatives, no any of that. We’re doing water bottles because I always . . .
People want to know, “How do you keep your energy up?” And so, I said I have a little survival kit. Every day I drink a lot of water. I have health food, healthy nutrition all day, so it’s the energy drink. I said I always talk out loud about what I’m doing and gauge other people in my dreams and stuff, so we have t-shirts. We’re going to have wrist bands, and then I said you’ve got to end the day with some great, great red wine. So, we’re going to have “Yes” energy wines.
So, we have all this stuff if you’re going to buy three books, you get a t-shirt. If you’re going to buy five books, you get the whole survival kit. It’s all sorts of fun around it.
Andrew: He’s going to private label it, meaning he sells the products that you create?
Loral: He’s creating the product and we’re private labeling my brand on it.
Andrew: I see. You’re selling it to your audience. Can you say who he is? What’s the name of this billionaire?
Loral: I’ve got to get him tomorrow, and then I can tell you.
Andrew: OK. All right. People will see it on YesEnergy.com.
Loral: Right, tomorrow, but he’s very funny. I can’t wait. Somebody I can talk about, so like Harry Denton. He and I have been friends for a long time, so you’ll hear from world leading economists, the cynicism of the world, and the whole world is going to collapse and bottom out to very big spiritual leaders in the world that are tough to get.
Andrew: Who’s got the biggest database of users who you’re going to be interviewing?
Loral: Well, I just got another gentleman who’s blind. He’s a paraplegic. He’s on the Special Olympics and an amazing, amazing man. He owns a TV show of all things. He owns a huge TV station, so he’s going to be interviewing and the guy who started the MLS system and the magnet swipe. Like who knows him? He’s almost 80. He’s the cutest little thing I’ve ever met, so he’s probably another billionaire. He won’t tell me what he’s worth, but I think if you created MLS and the Magnetic Swipe that you’d be worth a lot of money and he’s . . .
Andrew: Who has the biggest list of potential customers? Who has the biggest database?
Loral: Who would have the biggest database? How do you think?
Andrew: Better be the [thrillionaires].
Loral: Yeah. I think the thrillionaires.
Andrew: Thrillionaires, I’ve never heard of them.
Loral: Yeah. This friend of mine, I think he’s probably worth a billion, he says he’s only worth multi-million, but he’s gone to space with Richard Branson. I interviewed him yesterday, he’s an Australian, wildest human in fact, one of the things we’re going to be doing together is I’m taking a lot of my graduates, ’cause my graduates really become my friends, because we do a lot of business, we just, I don’t call them graduates anymore, once you become like a business player, love to hang out, that’s my circle of, we buy and sell companies and I wanted, my goal always with my kids is to take them to every continent.
I was sharing with Nick, who owns the Thrillionaires, who was interviewed yesterday so he’ll be on this summit, some of his wildest adventures and he said, ‘Well, I’ve taken people to Antarctica.’ I said, ‘Oh, my god, we’re going to go too.’ So, he said, ‘I take you on a private cruise, it’s out of South America and there would be like 52 of us on the boat,’ and so we’re going to go in 2014. We’re going to go and build igloos and watch the march of the penguins and do all this stuff.
Andrew: Cool.
Loral: That’s really the end game. That’s the game that I always play is I love having big adventures with cool people who have the same conversation around money and business not because we’re addicted to it it gives your life a lot of choice. So he’s fun and he’s got a massive world following he’s gone down, his other big adventure that he’s known for where he has dove to the Titanic and actually was photographed on the bow of the Titanic. Just wild things.
Andrew: All right. Let’s go back and find out how you got here. I read in 1997 you and Robert Kiyosaki had a conversation, is that right?
Loral: Yep. That’s right.
Andrew: What was the conversation about?
Loral: The conversation was about his cash flow game [??]. Actually in late ’96 was when we started our conversation. Then ’97 was when we formally had contracted business and [??] was just coming off the market, he had his cash flow game. I said, ‘I don’t know what you do with the game,’ but at that point I was doing a lot of consulting inside corporations, I said that executive want, they need, I mean, they’re managed and given bonuses on an expense line, but not a profit line. I said, we need to teach them more financial literacy and anyway years later, five years later, I helped form cash flow clubs all over the world, was a master distributor for the cash flow game.
It was assumed, which when, then during that time, when I was like in my early 30’s, knew I was going to be a single mom, I was 33 and headed into 34 and I said that I got to get it all together and become a millionaire. It was during that time, but also what I did is I used and this is really, really just the way I think about products, and how I use them for services, and I put it all together in a unique ways so, I took the cash flow game and I would be teaching people cash flow. Obviously, I would be watching their performance and their behavior and I would see people that were very comfortable with money and striking deals on a paper game and becoming millionaires in the game.
I’m thinking, what we can all go do, real estate. During that time, how I became a millionaire that year, I called someone 20 years my senior. That millionaire next door that you always know but never asked for help. I said I’m going to be a single mom soon and I need to make a lot of money and I said you’ve done it in real estate and you’ve offered to help me. Let’s go and he said, ‘Let’s get on a plane we’re going to Oklahoma City.’ I said, ‘Oklahoma, you got to be kidding?’ He said, ‘No, we’re going to go buy a lot of real estate.’ So we went, we went through Kansas, Oklahoma, North Texas and we were in this whole tour and we had spent all the money I had, and he had, and a couple of other folks had. He said, ‘Go raise $16 million.’ I looked at him and I said, ‘You’re out of your mind. I don’t know how to raise money. I wouldn’t even know how to put it on paper.’ And he said, ‘Here’s some lawyers, here’s some accountants, figure it out.’ Of course, he did that as a mentoring activity and I did, I was so intent on figuring it out.
So, we started doing big real estate projects and for years, that’s actually how I became a millionaire, and did a lot of projects and years later after that, what I realized is that I was doing so much real estate, I was in 29 markets, I was closing a lot of real estate projects, we were doing land lease options, wholesaling you name it, we were doing it. I had this whole following and I thought why am I not charging these people? I looked up at this seminar space, that I actually don’t necessarily like even though I’m kind of in it, because you get categorized, but I thought why am I not charging these people? I’m helping them all buy real estate and we’re doing a lot of projects together so, I said, ‘You know what, if you want to keep doing this you need to pay me five grand,’ and heck, they did.
So, this guy was my first real multi-million dollar business. That was my first real charge into and when I left the Kiyosaki gang and started LiveOutLoud, in 2001, I was really doing real estate education. We were taking people on tours, I got out of doing any deals that wouldn’t do deals with the people, I would just teach them how to do deals because if they didn’t know how to do deals they didn’t know how to raise money. Most people don’t even know how to look at a cash flow analysis of a basic deal, if it’s good or not. So, that’s kind of how I got started.
Andrew: All right, let me break down some of what we talked about so far. We talked about the cash flow game. Then you went off and you bought property in Oklahoma. Then you raised $16 million; then you started teaching. I want to break all of this down and make sure that I understand how you got here. So, the first thing is that you said the cash flow game. This is Robert Kiyosaki, author of Rich Dad, Poor Dad, came up with this game that people could play that would teach them about money. And you said that in the five years that you worked with him, you helped spread that game across the world. How did you do that?
Loral: Made it up. And I think that’s the lesson in my say yes energy, figure out how. Because he said, do you know how to do it? And I remember looking, and I said, ‘Yep.’ And in my heart of hearts I’m thinking, how do I do that? But I knew I was a good instructor, trainer, teacher. I knew I knew how to teach people. So I broke the game down, was the first thing. I actually went into San Francisco and met some game designers, again, a brilliant team of people who could break it down and say, how would you teach learning? Not just have people play a game, but what are the learning points. So we broke out all the learning points, and then I started charging people to come and play games for three hours on night.
Andrew: But the game, this is before you just broke it down to find out what the learning points are, so you can emphasize them?
Loral: Yep. And then I charged people in the beginning.
Andrew: How did you get customers? How did you get people to start playing it, if you were starting to charge for it?
Loral: Again, I get people to email market. I just started talking about it, go to chamber meetings, go to real estate investor clubs. I just spread all around San Francisco, where I was living, and just told people to come to game night, between $39 and $59 a night, depending on where we were doing it. And I’d have banks host us, because I was making a lot of money earlier in the day. So, I’d have banks host us in their conference rooms. I’d charge people to come, and then I’d sell them the game at the end of the night. And I sold a bunch of Kiyosaki’s books.
And I think the learning for people is, until you have your own stuff, like I have a lot of my own production, my own services and products, but I didn’t. My first five years I sold Robert’s stuff, and then the next year, I mean, real tactically there, Andrew, I sold Sandy [Bodkin’s] tax products. I sold Keith Cunningham’s stuff.
Andrew: Sold to who? To a mailing list that you had?
Loral: I started generating mailing lists.
Andrew: How’d you get your email list?
Loral: I generated an email list, and Bob Parker, who is one of my mentors already had a big list, and so he would endorse me to his database, and then I’d get a little bit of his list. And then I’d go to other people and say, do you have an email list, and can you invite them to come play the game and I’ll share money with you. So I sort of just made up this model. I didn’t know that the formal affiliate model actually existed. I was just sharing, ‘cuz I was allowed to share and if you can help me I can help you. And I’ll help your people get richer.
Andrew: Let me see if I understand this, Loral, ‘cuz this is still new to me. So what you do is, you’d go to people who have big lists and you say, if you promote your list that they can play this game I’m obviously going to earn some money, but I’m going to give you a share of that money. And in the process I’ll also collect the list of people who I can then offer other products to. And that’s how the business was built in the beginning.
Loral: You’re exactly right.
Andrew: And how did you go beyond the city that you’re in where you can host and meet people at banks, and talk to them one on one? How do you go beyond San Francisco?
Loral: A lot of the people who are playing the game then would raise their hand and say, ‘Now can I take this game to Denver? Can I take this game to Atlanta? Can I take this game to New York? And so, then I had to do the next thing, which was create the trainer. I had to teach people how to teach the game, ‘cuz I knew how to teach it, but I hadn’t really created the format to teach other people how to teach it. So then I created a train the trainer. And then I had them come in and I would teach them, and they would do the same thing I was doing in San Francisco in their city. And all of a sudden, cities were just building up everywhere, and people would come to these game nights.
Andrew: Did you charge for the train the trainer, or did you get a percentage of the sale the trainers made?
Loral: I started with the percent, and then I realized that a lot of people could train, but they couldn’t market, and they weren’t getting very many people in the room. So then, I skipped that model, and thought, it’s your own business. Take care of all that yourself, and then I just charged a little bit of money in the beginning to train trainers. So I had this whole army of people in the world, and at the end of it, like the fourth or fifth year of my time in that, we were having a training once a month in Marin County, which is north of San Francisco, and upward of 70 or 80 people per month that were training people on how to go out in the world and train. And then a group brought me over to Australia and I trained a bunch of them. I mean, there were a lot of trainers training people how to do games.
So, when I wrote my first book, The Millionaire Maker, what did they put right next to it, The Millionaire Maker Game. So, I have a game, too. It’s a broader wealth-building game. It’s not just about cash flow real estate. It’s about becoming a millionaire. It’s about how to do business development, marketing, sales, team, asset allocation, restructuring tactics. It’s a bigger financial conversation, but I put a game. I did exactly what I watched Robert do, ‘cuz he was a great mentor. I put a book right next to that game, and then I have a whole army of people in the world doing Millionaire Maker games, now, for me.
Andrew: I love learning this stuff. OK. So, then the next thing you said you did was you went to Oklahoma. You started looking around for . . .
Loral: Kansas, North Texas.
Andrew: What kind of real estate were you buying? It didn’t sound like you had much money at the time.
Loral: I didn’t. I had my little 401K from Chevron. So there was a point right before that in the early 90s that I worked for Chevron for five years. So my past, past life, outside of finance, is I actually have a master’s degree in exercise physiology, which is an odd combination. But Chevron hired me when I was 24 years old to work on offshore oar rigs in the Gulf of Mexico. So I lived in New Orleans, of course in the French quarter because I was in my 20s and partied a lot.
So I would fly offshore in helicopters and design fitness centers on offshore oar rigs, believe it or not. I did that for three years. Then that’s how I arrived in San Francisco, because they hired me to work in corporate headquarters in San Francisco to do it in refineries and marketing centers.
So I helped the employee fitness and back injury prevention as a part of safety and human resources. I designed all that. So with my finance background I could do all the statistical analysis for the cost of a back injury, the cost of a smoker, the cost of an overweight employee.
So I was doing that for Chevron, knew I wanted out, and then that’s when I met Robert in 1996. That was my exit out of there.
Andrew: But the real estate that you did, when you were flying around, buying, what kind of properties did you buy?
Loral: My point of that whole Chevron story is I used my 401k to start, so I had to buy [??]
Andrew: I see, ok, so that’s how you got the money to buy. So then what kind of properties did you buy and how did you make money off of them?
Loral: Thank God for my millionaire next door mentor. We diversified, which was the greatest move that I ever learned. So we bought some large apartment complexes, which is where we needed the 16 million, so we bought some very large apartment complexes that were a great cash flow. In fact, still have some of them still there today, after all these years.
Then we did some four-plexes, duplexes, some smaller stuff that we would just fix and flip. So were using “fix and flip” to make the cash, and then we’d buy longer term holds. So we just started this whole process of fix and flip, take the cash, buy holds. It just grew and grew and grew.
Andrew: Why did he help you? A lot of times I hear who people that I interview get mentors, and I just don’t know what’s in it for the mentors? But this time especially, why would he come and help you buy real estate instead of buying it himself?
Loral: Because he knew he had a little worker in me, right? He knew that I had a lot of guts and I’d get stuff done. He knew I’d accomplished stuff. So he took huge interested in that. He also knew by then that I knew how to grow a database, and so I actually knew a lot of people, through the cash flow, I knew people with money. So he knew that if he could help organize me, and he took a percent, he didn’t have to do a lot of work but use his brains to teach me what to do.
Andrew: What was the deal that you made to the people who played the game?
Loral: So that was a completely different deal. In the game was just the game.
Andrew: You were meeting people who had money through putting the cash flow game on around the country. How did that help you buy real estate?
Loral: Because I saw people’s psychology. I’ll tell you, just because people have money, and a lot of your viewers, I know, have worked with VC, money is money, but psychology is a big, big piece of it. Money follows management, so what I really learned is the psychology of smart money.
So I knew how to find smart money and people that were more sophisticated, that wanted to do more sophisticated deals. I had an enormous legal team around me that knew how to put the proper paperwork together. We were all in the deal, so I wasn’t selling a security or selling any of that. We would actually do projects…
Andrew: You’re saying you would partner with the people who played the game, you’d pool your money together –
Loral: Years later, they’d already played.
Andrew: Sorry?
Loral: It wasn’t quite like I used the games at that point, because a lot of people who just played the games were too beginner, but through a lot of my network, I met people with the money.
Andrew: OK, how did you raise the 16 million dollars?
Loral: Asked.
Andrew: Asked who?
Loral: Asked, it’s the kind of the [??] say yes to asking. Great projects. Again, put a great team together who knew how to capitalize and create cash flow. So I was the youngest, greenest person on the team. We assembled quite a team of people, property managers, who knew how to manage the projects, turn for great cash flow, make sure that the investors had really smart monthly communication. We had third party accounting firms. We really, from ground zero, and I’m known for that too, just to go and let’s get it done, let’s get it done right.
So we would put together projects where we’d buy an apartment complex for two or three million and then there might be 10-15 of us on the projects and we’d own it together.
Andrew: I see. The next thing I think you told me was you started teaching, which I’m guessing is Loral Langemeier.com, or Live Out Loud is the name of the business?
Loral: Live Out Loud, which the emphasis of that came from you have to have a conversation about money. You have to live out loud about your conversations. So many people with money-it was the same thing when I was in the health world. So many people live so quietly; they want to make money but they don’t tell anybody they want to make money, they don’t tell anybody their problems or how debt they are. They really just live quietly.
The truth is, many of us have a lot of great experience we can share. I would just start educating people. I also think that my heart and soul-and I love that at the bottom of yours you say “Mixergy is a Mission,” because mine’s really a mission at this point. The conversation about money is so bad in the world that most people think it’s get a job, get a 401k, and live debt-free. That’s not how wealthy people live. You know it and I know it; we’re entrepreneurs, we grow, we have corporate structure, we invest. We play in the global marketplace at this point. We hang out with smart people, not because all of us are smart, but because we make a choice to not tolerate. I really know that that’s what was creating success. As I looked at all the people buying real estate, and then I just started teaching people. I have so many students who have just done massive, massive projects in all sorts of countries. I have a student, different than real estate, but in business, who bought a recycled glass project. They used how to raise capital, they raised $2.7 million, sold it to a Canadian company just last year for $9 million and it’s this beautiful recycled glass.
Andrew: I want to dig into that in a moment.
Loral: Ah, but we got-
Andrew: I want to continue with your narrative. Actually, my researcher here, I’ve been going through her notes and using them as an outline for the conversation. My researcher says that Lorallangemeier.com states that liveoutloud was established in 2003 and grew to 19 million dollars in five years, which is 2008, but liveoutloud.com states that it started in 2001, not 2003, and grew to 21 million in five years, not 19 million. What are the years?
Loral: So 19’s a typo, and just needs to shift.
Andrew: OK.
Loral: I mean 19 was the year before. 2001 was our legal incorporation
I knew that we were having, Robert and I were splitting. I was ready to do my own work; I wanted to do it my way and in a different way. In 2001 and 2002 we really had started the education part and that revenue was going into that company, but I was still in a relationship with Robert. 2001 is the legal start. 2003, the reason that’s noted a lot is because Bob Proctor and John Burley, Jay Conrad Levinson, who wrote all the Guerrilla Marketing, and who else? Sandy Botkin. Four amazing men who were in my life at that time, helping mentor and just kind of coach me through a lot of that. They said “You really need to go teach. You need to be on big platforms.” I said “I’m not going to do that. I could just keep doing real estate and buying businesses, I’m really not going to do that.”
So we had a little bet; they said “If we put a room together, of a whole bunch of people, we’ll all send emails to our database and we’ll sell tickets and put a bunch of people in a room.” We had about 500 people in a room on August 23rd, 2003. It was my mom and dad’s anniversary, that’s why I remember the day. We had a bet that if 100 people would buy coaching and work with me, that would be enough evidence and that that’s what I’m supposed to be doing next. I said “They won’t do it.” Only they did do it! I think 102 people bought that day. So, liveoutloud. We always say that that was kind of the catalyst, but it had legally already started way before, it started really in 2001. It was in a smaller scale, we were making a couple hundred grand in that education side, it wasn’t a big focus.
Andrew: OK.
Loral: 2003 was our “Alright, I’m going for it. Let’s go, go, go!” In 2004 I wrote Guerrilla Wealth with J. Conrad Levinson, which then online created some really good traction. McGraw-Hill came to me in 2005 and said “We want you to write the Millionaire Maker book. We want you to be another woman in a different conversation,” because my conversation is very different from Susie or Jean Chatzky and some of the other women in this space. They said “You need to write about real wealth-building and entrepreneurism.” I said “I don’t write, I’m not going to do it.”
Andrew: How do you get a few million dollars? I understand the first teaching event you put together that your friends sent out an email to each of their lists and they got an audience to come in and pay to watch you. How do you grow from there to millions of dollars?
Loral: We made half a million dollars from that first workshop, so we kept doing them. We kept doing them for a while. There was a point, in 2007 I won my first Fastest Growing Women-Owned Company in San Francisco. That was our first 21 million dollar year. How did we do it? I put it in-
Andrew: Yeah.
Loral: I think this is the part a lot of people don’t realize what creates that kind of revenue; it’s sales. It’s marketing and sales. Clearly you have to have a product that sells, and we knew how to produce results. We know how to make millionaires. I can help you make money, I can help you get a business, but if you never learn to market in sales, where I’ve really become, just a master of teaching people, how do you market? Exactly this conversation; how do you grow a list? And then how do you monetize that list?
Andrew: So how did you grow your list in the beginning? How did you grow it to a place where you could sell it? Where you had enough people to buy it?
Loral: Well, in the beginning, and one of your questions is, you know, what are some of my biggest challenges, and it’s horrible tech teams. Horrible tech teams. So, my list would grow and then all of a sudden we’d lose the data, and I got so frustrated doing that. So, that’s just a huge learning–hire great amazing tech people to hold your database together. And have the ability to generate leads online.
Andrew: How do you do that? How do you generate leads?
Loral: I’ll tell you. One of our greatest campaigns is Askloral.com. And anybody can go to Askloral.com and ask me any question. And once a month I become live. Sometimes it’s up to two hours. In December we do one that’s four hours long. In fact, this is our one-year anniversary this month, of Ask Loral, when we started this. And you can ask me any question online and I’ll answer it, I’ll come live through a video stream like this. And I’ll answer your questions. So I just give. I give a ton of content away.
Andrew: How does that lead to a big database–you answering questions?
Loral: Because people love the advice. They love staying engaged. I’ll let people stay in our community for free. People can come out and see me. I think the number one pivotal things that I do that most people don’t do is actually do love people. And I speak all the time. I love speaking, I love teaching. And I know how to do it really well.
Andrew: I’m thinking about myself or someone in my audience who says, Loral’s got a big audience. She says that she’s sold well. That’s how she made the millions of dollars in the first five years of her business. What do I do to repeat her success, or to learn from it? Well, she built up a list first, and then she sold to it. She’s saying; build up a list by answering questions online. That doesn’t seem like it would be enough to get them to decide.
Loral: That’s only one. You’ve got to have good search engine, optimization. You’ve got to have good social media. You have to have all the online technologies, and you know techniques now. But the biggest one, where I get an offline following, is that I speak. I speak to audiences. I’ve spoken at Tony Robbin’s Stage. I did that big tour with Donald Trump for two years on the learning annex. I was on those stages. I was on the big billboards. So I would speak in front of thousands and thousands of people. So, there’s a lot of branding.
Andrew: And the people who watch you will remember to go to your website and give you their email address?
Loral: Absolutely. I’m hysterical. I’m really actually, and I don’t say that like I’m arrogant. You know good speakers and bad speakers.
Andrew: But people are so lazy, and they can’t remember. Like, neither one of us will say it, I wonder if the person who’s listening to us right now remembers the URL of the place they can go and watch me be interviewed by you and all those billionaires and millionaires. I don’t think that they’re going to remember the domain. I actually had to scroll up to the top of my notes to see it. That doesn’t seem like a huge way to grow your list. Is it?
Loral: It is.
Andrew: That’s the big way? By speaking at those events? Then some people will go check out your site and register?
Loral: Right. Live Out Loud is really easy to remember. And when people see me, which is why I wrote the book and called it, Yes Energy, I live in Yes Energy. All my energy is Yes Energy. I give a lot. It’s quite a complex combination of marketing, and how we bring in leads. But the sales process is extraordinary. Everybody gets a follow up within 24 hours. It’s a give/give all the time.
Andrew: So, the part of getting the email list takes a while and it’s hard to explain, here maybe. But once the person gets on the list, what do you do to be able to sell to them? I understand that you guys are a sales machine, considering amount of revenue you do. What did you do then, in those five years, to sell to the list that was different from other people who just have lists?
Loral: Oh, I can tell you one significant thing, we ask for what they want. And I’ll tell you, nobody does it. Most people design in their own little head what they think that other people are going to want and they end up launching poor. So they’ll design it, they write books about it. They do all this design. Then they launch, and they hope to God there’s an audience. I’ve always done it completely different. In fact, in my sales training I teach people you should ask, tell and ask. Stop telling people how fabulous you are. Ask them what they want. So, we survey all the time. We survey our list and say, ‘What do you want me to talk about?’
I have a huge breadth of experience, in marketing, sales. I have a women’s program called, Wealthy, a man is not a plan. I’m a single mom of two kids. I can talk about how to raise kids, and take them all over the world with me, and how do I really accomplish that, and a lot of women want to know. They want to know about all sorts of stuff. They want to know about my psychology. They want to know about the divorce I went through.
Andrew: So you ask them, what is it you want, they tell you and that’s how you write the books and create the stuff. OK. And then, that’s what gets you to sell such big numbers, because you ask?
Loral: I think it’s a huge . . . if I had to put my hand on anything I would say it’s because I ask them what they want and the reaction is extraordinary. Our student results are extraordinary. And our retention rates are extraordinary, because they produce results. A lot of times they’ll say this is your last seminar, because I don’t want you to have to go to seminars. Once you get in a community, build a community of smart people around you, stop tolerating and hanging out with people who are negative who tell you you can’t do anything, and go grow the life you want! We allow a lot of freedom in a community. We’re truly a community of thousands and thousands of people. There are people who have made way more money than I have. It’s not a competition here, it’s not like that. It’s very open and it’s encouraging, and I think that’s a very big part of it-
Andrew: What about upsells? From what I can see by doing research, you’re really good at upselling. Someone might buy a book, but they end up buying continuity service in addition to it. Tell me about how that factors in, because that seems pretty profitable.
Loral: Well, it’s because I understand a lot about human behavior. Humans don’t [bad audio] say they want to do. What a lot of people really want, and I’m also not just a coach in it’s terms, I mean I was in the first International Coach Federation, I’m master certified by the I.C.F, I’m truly trained in a lot of behavioral psychology and sciences, so I also know how humans perform-
Andrew: Tell me, by the way, you don’t have to give me your credentials. I’m here and talking to you because I admire all the success that you’ve achieved; I want to learn from it, so I’ll take it all for granted.
Loral: Yep.
Andrew: How do you upsell in a way that I don’t know, and that maybe my audience hasn’t learned how to do that? Teach us that.
Loral: Give them what they want, and do it in not only a monthly basis, but on a weekly basis. Again, we have completely open forums. What do you want? What help can we provide? Where are you stuck, where are you falling down? We’re constantly asking where are you broken in the model, because the model works. We know how to teach you to make money. What happens is, if you’re watching and I’m teaching you to make money, something’s broke, right? Your website’s broken, the way you talk about your business is broken, their own upsellability. I have a dog walker. When I met her, she and her mom were making $1000 a month walking dogs. I said “So you just don’t want to walk dogs. What else can you sell the people? If you’re going into their home, you have confidence, and you have confidentiality to go into their home. What else could you do? Why not deliver groceries? Why not offer to house-sit when they go away on trips, to do more? Why not do a website full of animal products, and sell them dog food, dog supplements, and everything else a dog needs? Don’t just do the dog walking, monetize that client.” So that’s why-
Andrew: Forgive me, I could understand that. What I’m curious about is, how does Loral do it? You are the machine. They are someone who learned from you. You are the teacher; I want to know how you do it. I’m seeing online that someone might buy a book and end up with a 19.95 monthly expense.
Loral: Yep.
Andrew: Teach me what you upsell them on, and how you get them to say yes.
Loral: I upsell them on a weekly touch with me. I go live, literally, I am live every week with my students.
Andrew: OK.
Loral: I think a lot of peoples’ mistake, the learning, is stop videotaping and downloading everything where you’re not accessible. Stay extremely accessible, is part of my formula. I am very accessible. In addition, I have eight hours of live coaches you can call to get help. Wherever you’re broken in that week, you can call in nine ours a week for support, live support.
Andrew: OK.
Loral: Not this pre-programmed stuff where I go on a cruise for a month and then be gone. A lot of people look at my life and say I’ve set it up to where I’m working too hard, but I say I don’t know that it’s work because I love doing it. I also do makeovers that are live examples. When I’m on live, Andrew, I’ll have students who come on and say “You know, it’s not working and I need help in this area,” so they’ll come live onto the video stream and I’ll make over whatever is broken with them, live. I know enough that I don’t need a script, I don’t do any of that, it’s all completely out of experience. Then we post that online for all the other students to see in the continuity program.
Andrew: I see, OK.
Loral: When you join, you could go back to probably hundreds of hours of makeovers and see who you are most like. I could see Suze and see “Oh, that’s where I’m broken, that’s the advice I need.” It’s just a huge live share, and we let all those people forum and talk together as well.
Andrew: What does that cost, that upsell? How much is that per week or per month?
Loral: For the nine, if they want nine hours a week, it’s $149 a month.
Andrew: $149 a month, OK.
Loral: They get nine live hours, they get a forum, we encourage people to sell stuff in the forums. Not spam! That’s the other thing, people just spam online, they do a horrible job and just don’t get anywhere. How do you gracefully provide service to other people and sell? If I do a makeover on a writer, for example, I fixed her business model. She wasn’t making money because her pricing was charging per word. She said “Well, it’s X dollars per word.” I said “That means nothing from me. I can’t buy from you today. That’s a huge obstacle; now I have to go think about it, and I don’t know what to think about because I’m not going to count words.” Give me a price that I can actually buy today. So what seemed to be little things to, probably a lot of our viewers, but a lot of people had a lot of obstacles in the way that they allow people to buy.
So the other part is make it easy for people to interact and make sure that you have good customer service scheme. So that people are talking and engaging and serving people. As long as you serve people you’ll always make cash.
Andrew: OK. Let’s talk about you said that you’ve done, that you’ve invested alongside some of your students. Do you have an example of a project that you invested in alongside one of your students?
Loral: Well, I want to clarify, they’re ex-students. They’re all done.
Andrew: Ex-students, graduates who are now friends.
Loral: Because when people here that, Andrew, they’ll say, ‘Oh I’ll be your student so she can,’ I don’t do deals with my students. Once they’re all done, graduated, staying successful in their own right, their own millionaire, if we find a project, we may do one. So we did a [??] company, which is a, you talk about a business model of auto ships and month continuity, people will love buying vitamins and anti-aging stuff on line and so we bought a company for about, there was 42 of us I think, we bought a company for $8 million [??] and turned for $24 [??] I love doing those.
Andrew: You bought it for $8 million . . . oh sorry, the connection is a little bad, a little funky today, but you say you bought a vitamin company for $8 million . . .
Loral: In three years for $24.
Andrew: . . . you sold it for $24 million, it was a vitamin continuity program when you bought it, was there one in place?
Loral: [??] Yeah. We did a lot of education online. Our website was beautiful. We did a lot of education [??], a lot of ask nutrition questions. So we did a lot of the same kinds of campaigns that I do live, where people ask about different vitamins, different supplements. So we would be live and educational with them and people would sign up for $100 – $150 of vitamins, and anti-aging, and all sorts of glucosamine, and whatever they needed and that grew with such great cash flow that we were able to turn it. So it’s good.
Andrew: Over how long? It’s pretty incredible over how [??].
Loral: Three years.
Andrew: Over three years, tripled the value of the company.
Loral: Yeah. See my first grow. Yeah, it’s easy. What I love to do, if people will play, is double companies, it’s so fun. So like there was a pizzeria that was completely bankrupt. In fact, they closed the doors and a couple of our partners just reopened the doors, put a little money and fixed it up. Then one of the partners maintained it.
That was a four month turn and 42%. There’s a lot, there’s so much available on the market right now, Andrew, if you — a lot of people listening may say, ‘Well, I don’t know how to do it,’ because that’s where teams of people, I don’t do every piece of it. I have great accountants. I have great lawyers. I have some other smart executors and that’s really the circle of people I play with and hang out with.
Andrew: What’s the name of the vitamin company?
Loral: It is, it was called NutraHealth. The company that bought it changed the name so I don’t know what the, I don’t know what the name of the company is now.
Andrew: So if there’s one thing that you did that had the most impact on that company, what was it? What would you say it is?
Loral: The part that I played in that company?
Andrew: Yes.
Loral: Is my marketing ability.
Andrew: Marketing. How did you market it?
Loral: A lot of online right now. They were doing off line. They were sending out the traditional direct mail pieces and I said you got to get online and start talking to your customers and asking what they want. So that’s when we picked up an anti-aging line, we picked up glucosamine and all sorts of other products. What people really wanted was more anti-aging products.
They were, we were doing only weight loss products when we first bought the company so, it was very kind of old model company when we bought it, which is why we got it fairly reasonable and they also had no sales team. So we saw the sales team and the desks were all empty and I said lets fix the marketing machine to drive more online as well as offline, plus we went to retail stores and we sold.
Andrew: What’s the marketing machine online? I want to focus on a little bit because I know that this is a big business and I’ll never be able to understand all in the last minutes we have together. What’s the marketing machine online that you put in place that didn’t exist before?
Loral: Well, cleaned up the website. Just the basic website cleanup with an opt- in box. People couldn’t even go in and give us their name or phone number or email.
Andrew: Gotcha. So, ask for the opt-in box ask for the opt-in information. How would you get people to come to the site and give you the opt-in information?
Loral: Because we would give them reports that we would generate every month. We would give them great reports on nutrition, weight loss and again, you would say, ‘How did you know how to write a report?’ We hired great copy writers to write reports because we’d survey people. What do you really want? You’ve been with this company, we’re a new owner team, that’s what we did right out of the gate, we’re a new team of owners.
We really want to know what’s our client current database. What kind of things can we offer you? We learned a lot and we started building reports on those and then, that’s what I call these ask campaigns, we would come live and let’s talk to people live about their health issues and then we brought on doctors because we weren’t qualified to do that. So we said let’s bring on doctors to answer those questions or nutritionist to answers those questions. And in some cases pharmaceutical specialists would come on.
Andrew: And how would you get people in the door? I understand search engine optimization is very powerful and it’s something that you’ve mentioned a few times. I assume you do it well. What else besides search engine optimization do you use to get people to come to the website and to give you their opt-in information?
Loral: Pay per click, we did Adwords with Gladwords, we would buy space, we would buy, at that…
Andrew: And that would lead to a page where people would get the opt-in, the receiver report, they’re in your database and from there you get to market to them?
Loral: And you market, but I think the biggest piece too, I just don’t want to, cuz it’s not just about the marketing machine which I think a lot of folks understand. It’s putting live sales people. So as people would opt-in they would immediately get a phone call. Which is also what we do here at Lebitt [??]. It’s what I do with every company. Those two together will create gold in a company. A lot of people think that email marketing where I just would follow up. So if you gave me your email Andrew and I just would followed up with you and said you know, thanks for giving me your email I hope you enjoyed my report, la, la, la, and then a week later I email you and say do you want some vitamins? That’s not going to work.
But if a live person called you and say so Andrew did you read the report that you know, opted in for and most likely, most people say no, unfortunately that’s the truth. And I say, so when could you read that, and then lets set up an appointment to talk about your needs. And we would have a team right online following up and you would also have like a personal rep that would just take you through the process and get you your vitamin pack and then sell the next one and then up-sell. Same process to like, instead of you know, 50 dollars a month lets get people doing 150 dollars a month. Which is where the cash flow was for the evaluation we have.
Andrew: I see. Phone sales. I wouldn’t have through of that. I tend to think that everything has to happen online. Phone sales. Have people call up.
Loral: Sales. Have people call and be in a personal relationship with somebody. And that’s, it’s so, for us because we’ve been doing it now, this is our ten year anniversary of Live Out Loud from it’s legal start date, not the big event date. I’m really glad you found that for us cuz we should really clarify that. We will clarify that. But this is our ten years, I tell you, we would have created those gross, and all my students, I just mandated, you’ve got to put in, even if it’s only one person and at half time.
If you have somebody pick up the phone and care about your customers more and actually serve them ask them what they want and how you can help them. You increase your product line, services you provide. You actually get their input on to create the next thing. Versus sitting in a conference room which is how a lot of companies do it and just think about the next thing. Let your customers tell you what they want and then deliver it with excellence to them. And then get on the phone with them I think that’s the biggest piece.
Andrew: Go figure. I’d love to find someone out in the audience who does business this way who can come in here and talk to us about how they do it because I don’t think I’ve interviewed anyone who closes, who starts sales online by collecting leads and then closes sales over the phone. I’d love to do an interview in here about how that’s done. The website that I mentioned earlier that I alluded to during this interview, yesenergybook.com. Sorry, which site should we send people to?
Loral: Yesenergybook.com and go get my book and then through there you’ll find our interview with Andrew. And, what date are we airing? Do you have that?
Andrew: I have to figure that out.
Loral: OK. But we’re airing, I believe you’re the beginning of October so they can stay tuned and watch and then hear me interview you.
Andrew: I’d love to get your feedback people on it. Go check out yesenergybook.com if for no other reason I think you’ve got to go and check out the website just to find out the way that she’s marketing online. Laurel it’s just been fascinating being on both sides of the conversation with you. To be interviewed and watch the whole process that you do and to have you come on here and teach us through this interview. Thank you.
Loral: Well thank you, I appreciate it.
Andrew: Loral Langemeier. Thank you. Bye Loral.
